so, i did something stupid. i wrote what i thought to be a sarcastic and humorous message to a boy on friendster that has a vendetta against "emo" music. i made a very very poor argument that belle and sebastian are a "emo-isk" band, and therefore liking them, he had emo in his blood, and was just in denial about it. so, i started a war. he wrote me a very long, and what i found to be humorous retort to my message. i am sure that he wanted to make me cry with they way he was choosing his words, but it just made me laugh. so, it now comes to the point of this post. i have three questions for you (one of which is more of a proposal). question one. what french movie that came out in 1975 did some of the lyrics from "the state i am in" come from and or were inspired by? if i am dumb because i do not know this, so be it. i am dumb. i jokingly used the line "i was happy for a day in 1975" to prove that b&s was "emo." emphasis on jokingly. oh dear. he quickly trashed my status as a!
fan of b&s because i did not know this fact.
question two.
what is your definition of emo, twee, and or any other hip music category that you might be able to help me define. all i know is weezer is emo, b&s is twee, and modest mouse is indie. what is used to define these placements, and is there a hierarchy?
question three, or more correctly stated, a proposal.
i propose that labeling bands into different subgroups might be a good idea for making it easier to make yourself feel as though you are part of a larger community, but here does it go bad? this message that the gentlemen sent me sparked a inner debate with me that either you find inherently interesting, or plainly boring and with obvious answers. either way, i want to know what you think. this man really hates this genre of music, and i am finding myself question what defines this genre, is his annoyance justified, and more importantly, why is this important? if we spent a lot of time labeling the bands we like into different categories, don't we lose sight on something that is supposed to be the reason we like music in the first place? when i was growing up and first started to listen to nirvana (my first "rock band," i did grow up in seattle after all), i instinctively denounced all my prior hip-hop albums. i did not listen to it for years. why would i want to listen to t!
his horrible mainstream media fed, brainwashing music about sex, drugs, and more sex? that is where i think i lost sight on the reason why we listen to music. some hip-hop is fun. some of it is really good. a lot of it is really bad, but if you take the time to listen, you can make your whole music experience so much more fulfilled. there is even good country music which if i heard myself say that six years ago, i would have jumped off a bridge in shame. maybe by dismissing the "emo" scene, this man is missing out on what could be his favorite band ever. oh well, his loss. i just have a hard time lumping a whole scene into one category and denouncing it.
if i understand what emo is then what makes a band emo?
every "emo" kid i know likes b&s, for that matter, they like joy division too. i am not saying that joy division is emo, ian curtis r.i.p., but if enough people for a sub group of a larger culture like a band, is that enough to revamp their status as possibly emo-isk (and or any other scene you would like to insert here), and thus a integral part of that sub group, alas making them the shamed emo? help help help. i know that this is ramble-ly, and i apologize, i just want to see what you think, and i did not have enough time to write an essay on why i think the labeling of music is a shameful practice, yet one that is addictive and helpful at the same time. maybe after you respond i will.
oh and mr. tony, the esteemed b&s fan on friendster who this poorly worded and overly philosophical (or underly as some might view it) post is about is on this list, please respond. i would love to hear your remarks.
tammy.
there is no silver lining on a mushroom cloud-ny times
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+-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+
+-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "peculiarly deranged fanbase" +-+
+-+ "pasty-faced vegan geeks... and we LOST!" - NME April 2000 +-+
+-+ "frighteningly named Sinister List organisation" - NME May 2000 +-+
+-+ "sick posse of f**ked in the head psycho-fans" - NME June 2001 +-+
+-+ Nee, nee mun pish, chan pai dee kwa +-+
+-+ Snipp snapp snut, sa var sagan slut! +-+
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
So here is the info...
http://www.nme.com/news/105909.htm
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+-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+
+-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "peculiarly deranged fanbase" +-+
+-+ "pasty-faced vegan geeks... and we LOST!" - NME April 2000 +-+
+-+ "frighteningly named Sinister List organisation" - NME May 2000 +-+
+-+ "sick posse of f**ked in the head psycho-fans" - NME June 2001 +-+
+-+ Nee, nee mun pish, chan pai dee kwa +-+
+-+ Snipp snapp snut, sa var sagan slut! +-+
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
hello Sinister,
blah blah I've been neglecting you lately etc. And now, after a sordid
weekend in Amsterdam with the *other* B&S fans, I'm crawling back to your
hopefully forgiving embrace.
sadly I don't really have to much to report, apart from the usual things
people say about being too busy to post much etc. However, I do have one
piece of actual NEWS, viz that Sinister's very own The Pinefox is paying a
visit to Dublin, and if you fancy meeting him you should make your way to
the upstairs lounge of the Lord Edward across the road from Christchurch at
8.00pm on thursday evening, where he, some people from the Dublin chapter of
I-Love-Everything, and I will be drinking beers and stuff and discussing
whether James Joyce would be able to take on Flann O'Brien in a FITE.
Other than that, nothing really. I agree with Mark C that tweeness is not a
state to which people should aspire. To all the other people to whom I owe
mails - you will have to wait just a little bit longer.
bless you all,
DV
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send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to
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+-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+
+-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "peculiarly deranged fanbase" +-+
+-+ "pasty-faced vegan geeks... and we LOST!" - NME April 2000 +-+
+-+ "frighteningly named Sinister List organisation" - NME May 2000 +-+
+-+ "sick posse of f**ked in the head psycho-fans" - NME June 2001 +-+
+-+ Nee, nee mun pish, chan pai dee kwa +-+
+-+ Snipp snapp snut, sa var sagan slut! +-+
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Tamra told us about Tony:
<<i made a very very poor argument that belle and sebastian are a
"emo-isk" band, and therefore liking them, he had emo in his
blood, and was just in denial about it. so, i started a war.>>
I think you should tell Tony that Belle and Sebastian are an "esk-imo" band.
That'll confuse him.
<<question one.
what french movie that came out in 1975 did some of the lyrics from
"the state i am in" come from. if i am dumb because i do not know this,
so be it. i am dumb. i jokingly used the line "i was happy for a day in
1975" to prove that b&s was "emo." emphasis on jokingly. oh dear. he
quickly trashed my status as a fan of b&s because i did not know this
fact.>>
I don't know the answer to this question. I reckon Tony's having you on. I
asked our friend the reference fox (http://www.fineran.demon.co.uk/basrefs/)
because i figured that if anyone would know then he would, but he didn't. He
has plenty of stuff to baffle this Tony with, though, if you have a look.
Did you know that Sleep the Clock Around is mentioned in The Voyage of the
Dawn Treader by CS Lewis? Or that the crippled friend in The State I Am In
is actually Stanley, the third brother of The Proclaimers, who was beaten up
by the other two when he was caught wearing contact lenses? Or that Elvis in
A Century of Elvis is actually a stick of broccoli? It's all true!*
<<question two.
what is your definition of emo, twee, and or any other hip music category
that you might be able to help me define. all i know is weezer is emo,
b&s is twee, and modest mouse is indie. what is used to define these
placements, and is there a hierarchy?
>>
Belle and Sebastian are not twee, they R!O!C!K! If you need any proof of
this just ask Mr Mark Casarotto if they are twee and he will show you how
much they rock with a bunch of fives.
The other day I went to the Civil Service Sports Day to represent my office
in the three-legged race. It was a hot day and on the way back the car that
I was in began to overheat, so our driver, Pete, decided to call the RAC. By
the time the car had been mended it was getting late and I was worried that
Pete was going to fall asleep at the wheel, so I suggested a singalong.
After singing Downtown, Bohemian Rhapsody, The Bare Necessities and the
complete works of Bonnie Tyler, we began doing a few solos and, naturally, I
got around to Belle and Sebastian. The thing is, after I'd sung a couple it
occurred to me that most belle and sebastian songs are pretty serious stuff,
and not the type of happy fare to cheer up a car of tired sweaty men in
shorts on the lumpy back seat of a ford escort. I thought of all the B+S
songs I know, and what they're about - loneliness, murder, suicide, rape,
bullying, mental illness, war, broken relationships - and decided they
weren't appropriate at all. So we sang The Bare Necessities again.
#
You eat ants!?
You better believe it, and you're gonna love the way they tickle!
The bare necessities of life will come to you..
They'll come to you..
#
My dictionary defines "twee" as a derogatory term: "excessively sentimental,
sweet or pretty".
I wouldn't call Belle and Sebastian twee.
Forcing bands into music types is always a bit of a dud. I think that B+S
would call themselves "indie", but everyone has a different idea of what
indie actually means.
When I think of emo-hop I think of Archel, and rifling through my filing
cabinet marked The Truth the World Cannot Handle I found these wise words of
hers:
http://www.missprint.org/sinister/mhonarc/200204/msg00154.html
If Tony keeps arguing with you we'll come over and beat him up. Bang on the
teeth, he'll be out for a week.
+++
The latest news on the album comes courtesy of a practically illiterate
article from Pitchfork (http://www.pitchforkmedia.com/) It sounds like Dear
Catastrophe Waitress will be released on October 7th. More interesting is
the accompanying photograph (ooh!!) of three smiling (catastrophe)
waitresses...
Bye folks, and don't forget to keep your fireworks in a biscuit tin.
R x
*This is a lie.
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+-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+
+-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "peculiarly deranged fanbase" +-+
+-+ "pasty-faced vegan geeks... and we LOST!" - NME April 2000 +-+
+-+ "frighteningly named Sinister List organisation" - NME May 2000 +-+
+-+ "sick posse of f**ked in the head psycho-fans" - NME June 2001 +-+
+-+ Nee, nee mun pish, chan pai dee kwa +-+
+-+ Snipp snapp snut, sa var sagan slut! +-+
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Dear Sinister-ians,
Howdy.I'm a long time lurker but now I need
the benefit of your knowledge. I'm quaking with
excitement for the NYC concert on Tuesday. I'm
planning to head up with some friends on Tuesday from
Philly but I'm not sure how early we should get
there . Is 10 am too early or do you think the park
will already be crawling with B&S fans? Also, does
anyone know if they'll have seats set up in front of
the bandshell or if it's all standing room ? I've
checked the Celebrate Brooklyn website but it didn't
say what the set-up was for benefit concerts. And
finally any advice on where to park would be
appreciated.
This will be my second B&S concert (the first was last
year in Philly).My song wish list :
Dog on Wheels
Century of Fakers
There's Too Much Love
The Loneliness of a Middle-Distance Runner
I Know Where the Summer Goes
Any of those would make me weep with happiness.The
Philly show last year rocked my ass off, so I have
high expectations for the NYC show.See you there and
thanks in advance for any information about the venue.
Colleen
=====
i know it's a warning
but all i can think of is
coffee in the morning,wine in the evening
and everything else is a black and boring bruise...
--lisa germano
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send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to
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+-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+
+-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "peculiarly deranged fanbase" +-+
+-+ "pasty-faced vegan geeks... and we LOST!" - NME April 2000 +-+
+-+ "frighteningly named Sinister List organisation" - NME May 2000 +-+
+-+ "sick posse of f**ked in the head psycho-fans" - NME June 2001 +-+
+-+ Nee, nee mun pish, chan pai dee kwa +-+
+-+ Snipp snapp snut, sa var sagan slut! +-+
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Friends, Sinisters, Countrymen, Lend me your Ears:
Miss Laura Llew pondered:
" Will the two proposed picnics merge into one HUGE prospectful picniciking
force or will there be a battle of the picnics - complete with food flinging
and ant cheerleaders? If there's a fight, then I'm siding with Eric and
Jay's picnic. They might be gay and might not know how to fight but at least
all battle plans will be executed with style. Actually, I take that back. I
hear GayJay wields a pretty mean foil. Personally, I just want an
opportunity to yell, "Parry his flank!" in public. Heaven knows that my life
already suffers seriously from absence of blade as it is."
I think we all know the answer to this. OF COURSE there will be a huge
fight.
More-vicious-than-two-girls-with-chips-on-their-shoulders-and-long-fingernails-to-boot-type
Big.
And as no one else is signing up to do it, I nominate myself El Supremo
Generalissimo of the Sinister forces.
As I see it, we will muster at dawn. We will arrange are forces thusly
*marks in the ground with his patented pointing stick* Our pikemen here in
four rows at the front, and flanking them behind on each side, the shot. I
recommend matchlock harqebuses, as they are dependable in battle, unlike
these new-fangled muskets and flint lock rifle. Behind the pikes, arranged
in several rows, the Infantrymen, and behind these our mounted men.
We strike at dawn, moving to take over their Picnique encampment. I'll
have some rousing speech ready. Something noble, "... that on this day of St
Picnic Piciannic, we shall all stand a tip-toe and rouse ourselves at the
name of Sinister!" And then we will all charge into battle under the cry
"Cry God for Honey, England and St Geroge!"
Of course, there will be some resistance. When a few men fall back, I'll
have another speech all ready to go: "Once more into the Breech dear
friends, once more into the Breech or fill up all the walls with Our
Sinister dead!"
Since god is obviously on our side, we shall win. I will be humble,
allowing hymns like the Te Deum and Laudamus be sung, but will gentle remind
you that France is now ours. We will split all the booty, Tuna Sandwiches
and such and drink Diet Coke well spik'd with Rum. We shall have
mirthsomeful tidings of dancing and music. We may even let theh Bowlie join
in.
Oh yes, it shall be swell. And I will marry me the Bowlie princess and
everything will be swell till that French bitch Joan of Arc fights back and
my kid gets killed.
Oh.
Wait.
I'm confusing myself with Henry V again. Dammit. Man.
Well anyway, I recommend beatin' some Bowlie.
GayJay
--
"The Posby falls into a Trance
In which it does a little Dance."
Edward Gorey
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+-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+
+-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "peculiarly deranged fanbase" +-+
+-+ "pasty-faced vegan geeks... and we LOST!" - NME April 2000 +-+
+-+ "frighteningly named Sinister List organisation" - NME May 2000 +-+
+-+ "sick posse of f**ked in the head psycho-fans" - NME June 2001 +-+
+-+ Nee, nee mun pish, chan pai dee kwa +-+
+-+ Snipp snapp snut, sa var sagan slut! +-+
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
I would be more than happy to lead the crew and set up a place to meet up.
However, we need more of a response from this List. Such as, is there
anyone actually attending the picnic if we do hold one?
Location will probably be at Berkeley somewhere. Maybe the Marina over
there? I have no clue.
So, if there is anyone interested in a sinister picnic, please post. We
need to match (or even outdo) the Brooklyn sinister kids! Come on!
Cheers,
Ian
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+-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+
+-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "peculiarly deranged fanbase" +-+
+-+ "pasty-faced vegan geeks... and we LOST!" - NME April 2000 +-+
+-+ "frighteningly named Sinister List organisation" - NME May 2000 +-+
+-+ "sick posse of f**ked in the head psycho-fans" - NME June 2001 +-+
+-+ Nee, nee mun pish, chan pai dee kwa +-+
+-+ Snipp snapp snut, sa var sagan slut! +-+
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Ben Lee said:
>A meet-up before next Friday's Berkeley show, perhaps?
That would be ideal. Come on reluctant picnic mummies and daddies let's get
it ohwn!
Something else just occured to me. Do you think it would be insensitive to
play "Don't leave the light on, baby" in Brooklyn?
tsk tsk, 5 line posts. What would the purists say?
Bapps
_________________________________________________________________
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send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to
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+-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+
+-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "peculiarly deranged fanbase" +-+
+-+ "pasty-faced vegan geeks... and we LOST!" - NME April 2000 +-+
+-+ "frighteningly named Sinister List organisation" - NME May 2000 +-+
+-+ "sick posse of f**ked in the head psycho-fans" - NME June 2001 +-+
+-+ Nee, nee mun pish, chan pai dee kwa +-+
+-+ Snipp snapp snut, sa var sagan slut! +-+
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
A meet-up before next Friday's Berkeley show, perhaps?
-----Original Message-----
From: Ian Rivamonte [mailto:irivamon@hotmail.com]
Sent: Friday, August 15, 2003 10:06 AM
To:
Subject: Sinister: San Francisco Happenings?
Hello Sinister.
Long time subscriber and lurker just came back from the dead (literally).
Anyways, reading the archives the last week or so and there seems to be
nothing going on for the San Francisco / Bay Area Sinister members other
than Ben Apps' attempt to have a gathering set up. I apologize if this is
repetitive, but has there been any resolution to that? Picnic? Meet-up?
Football wth B&S at Golden Gate Park (oh please invite me!)?
Any info would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!
Cheers,
Ian
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To send to the list mail sinister(a)missprint.org. To unsubscribe
send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to
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+-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+
+-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "peculiarly deranged fanbase" +-+
+-+ "pasty-faced vegan geeks... and we LOST!" - NME April 2000 +-+
+-+ "frighteningly named Sinister List organisation" - NME May 2000 +-+
+-+ "sick posse of f**ked in the head psycho-fans" - NME June 2001 +-+
+-+ Nee, nee mun pish, chan pai dee kwa +-+
+-+ Snipp snapp snut, sa var sagan slut! +-+
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
