Sandy Blair wrote:

...

if you would now like to argue that there is no difference between doing a tape for someone and recording Tigermilk onto CD, then go ahead. i have no difficulty in finding the strength to defend the bands future revenue as i feel they above anyone else here deserve and have earned it.

So you have no difficulty stealing from Bert Jansch? What did he ever do to you? Why doe Bert, Mr Jansch and all the little Jansches not deserve food on their table?

i don't intend just to live of a tape of jansch or anyone else. i do intend to order a shiny cd when i know that i do like him and have a rough idea of which one to buy. although shops like virgin our price have flexible returns policies they rarely have a good enough stock to be able to find new things and experiment musical preferences with. i know from working in an our price that i would have to order a jansch cd especially, special orders are exempt from their returns policy and as such there is no way i could experiment cheaply. -- s.willis wrote:

Hello all!

Here we go

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which is what i would like, so if anyone has a superior collection of bert jansch's recordings and would be willing to do a tape, i'd really appreciate it

mail me with your address and i'll get a tape sent of to you

david kitchen

I hope that you get copyright clearence first...

ah, wit in it's highest form.

I think that it was probably meant as a joke and not to be taken too seriously.

probably, but side swipes get me down, and eventually i feel i should defend myself and attemp to make it clear why it is an important issue (bootlegging that is).

...

you must be referring to the autumn spat about the recording of tigermilk onto CD? if so then i think you'd also agree that these things are in different leagues.

i agree and support home taping to help distribute music in a non-profit (swap) way. but i do not agree with the production of CD's, as these nearly always require a payment to be made, and it is from these that bootleggers are given the opportunity to produce mass quantitty bootlegs.

belle and sebastian may be wavering over the re-issue of tigermilk but they have stated publicly that this is something they plan, more a question of when. as such bootlegging would be a serious threat to it's imminent success and would threaten to reduce the revenue that the band would receive.

if you think that bootlegging is just a myth and doesn't affect the industry then maybe you should also read Saturdays Guardian. some of the facts held within that included: 70% of music available in the former USSR is bootlegged 22% of the italian music industry is bootlegged only £1.61 from a £13.99 CD ends up with the artist globally 1in 3 CD's sold is manufactured illegally

if you would now like to argue that there is no difference between doing a tape for someone and recording Tigermilk onto CD, then go ahead. i have no difficulty in finding the strength to defend the bands future revenue as i feel they above anyone else here deserve and have earned it.

Um, ok. (says the following as he fastens helmet and backs into a trench) if "doing a tape for someone" can include recording Tigermilk onto a tape (you didn't specify), why is that then different to recording Tigermilk onto a CD? If it is only going to one person anyway, why does it mattter what format it happens to be on? If, say, I had the equipment to record onto a CD would you be opposed to me copying Tigermilk onto it for a mate so that s/he could listen to it?

Love and hugs

Tom

the difference between a tape and cd recording is one of quality, but not a perceivable difference unless you're incredibly fussy. a tape is poorer quality and as such would not be used to produce bootlegs from, cd's on the other hand are accepted as a standard for a master recording and can be used in mass-duplication facilities to produce large runs of bootleg cd's. i really do not feel that a cd recording is of immediate threat to the band's future revenue, but it must be realised that should a mass production of Tigermilk on cd ever originate illegally, it would probably have been done by someone that we (as the list) know. simply because it is us (the fans, friends, record company, etc) that own the original vinyl Tigermilk, so it is most likely that the cd used would have originated from one of us (as it is unlikely that a cd produced from a tape would be accepted by any but the most worthless bootleggers). this is one of the most horrible realisations on this subject, and it is this i would love to prevent. we can serve ourselves and protect the band we love simply by restricting our own copies to tape format and not a digital (master) format. david kitchen (still trying to be lucid enough to make sense) @ the fanclub (and still not speaking on behalf of it or anyone else) -- ******************************************************************** Belle and Sebastian Fan Club merchandise, mail-outs, chat, lyrics, poetry, fiction http://www.totalweb.co.uk/bluesoda/ mailto:bluesoda@totalweb.co.uk ******************************************************************** ----------------------------------------------------------------------- . This message was brought to you by the Sinister mailing list. . To send to the list please mail "sinister@majordomo.net". . For subscribing, unsubscribing and other list information please see . http://www.majordomo.net/sinister . For questions about how the list works mail owner-sinister@majordomo.net . We're all happy bunnies humming happy bunny tunes. Aren't we? -----------------------------------------------------------------------

David Walker wrote:

Hey !!! You wrote..... "i know from working in an our price that i would have to order a jansch cd especially, special orders are exempt from their returns policy and as such there is no way i could experiment cheaply."

I manage a Virgin store and we always carry at least a collection of Bert Jansch in stock. I used work the Our Price stores, and yes, I agree, unlikely to have one in. As for flexibility of returns, yes I agree, all stores in the chain should at the very least exchange things you don`t like. So why not give it a go ????

Cheers, Tintin.

a cool idea i thought, so i called up the lady at virgin our price HO at Kew interchange (i can see it from my living room!), and was told that this is not the case.a return to virgin our price has to be a faulty one, which would then be replaced with the same item or an alternative only if the same item is not available. a special order is non-returnable unless the item can be proven to be faulty upon purchase, then it is the managers discretion which decides whether you can have an alternative item although she said that a manager should really just order the same item as a replacement. she also said that these policy's were in place to prevent virgin our price being used as a lending facility as the result would only ever be that virgin our price would have purchased a lot of obscure stock for the sake of a few sales, and as a business it was in their best interest to be doing the opposite (being little stock and selling it all). conclusion: i could order bert jasnch, but if it wasn't what i wanted i would be totally relying on the mood and character of the manager to decide whether or not i could return the said item. so there is a risk, you can't experiment or expand your taste by shopping, and it seems we're back with the option of taping to gain an idea of whether or not you like something. which brings us back to square one... -- david kitchen -- ******************************************************************** Belle and Sebastian Fan Club merchandise, mail-outs, chat, lyrics, poetry, fiction http://www.totalweb.co.uk/bluesoda/ mailto:bluesoda@totalweb.co.uk ******************************************************************** ----------------------------------------------------------------------- . This message was brought to you by the Sinister mailing list. . To send to the list please mail "sinister@majordomo.net". . For subscribing, unsubscribing and other list information please see . http://www.majordomo.net/sinister . For questions about how the list works mail owner-sinister@majordomo.net . We're all happy bunnies humming happy bunny tunes. Aren't we? -----------------------------------------------------------------------

PM - AU wrote:

Any news about the stolen goodies? I dreamt about it you know. Quite a good one. Been having a lot of funny dreams since I moved house. Spooky.

Peter, do you care to share???? Cheers, katrina. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- . This message was brought to you by the Sinister mailing list. . To send to the list please mail "sinister@majordomo.net". . For subscribing, unsubscribing and other list information please see . http://www.majordomo.net/sinister . For questions about how the list works mail owner-sinister@majordomo.net . We're all happy bunnies humming happy bunny tunes. Aren't we? -----------------------------------------------------------------------