January 2000 - Sinister - missprint.org

Sinister: B&S content interleaved with rubbish
by Nick.Dastoor＠guardian.co.uk 08 Jan '00

08 Jan '00

Are you all mad? Study at Stow is neither a description nor an order. It's an exhortation of sorts, kind of "C'mon kids - why not study at Stow - it's GRATE!!". I don't think I'm doing the cause any good, because my T-shirt has funny white stains on it. I really don't know what they are. Susannah used to ask us all to own up to getting up to hand whisky tricks to a B&S soundtrack. Those were the daze. I like this deliberate misspelling game alot. Actually, I don't. It unsettles me. 'A lot' is TWO SEPARATE WORDS. Unless you're talking about divvying up spoils or something. No one talks about spoils much anymore. Someone like Nick Heyward once sighed live on radio when listening to 'She's Leaving Home' and said "No one uses words like 'clutch' in pop lyrics anymore." The Beach Boys will never be as good as the Beatles because they had a perfect opportunity in 'Little Honda' but just went on about all the gears instead. Mind you, everything's automatic in America, isn't it? Hello everyone. Still here? I'm surprised that no one has posted about the B&S snippet in Select magazine yet. There's a mini-interview with Neil Robertson, talking about the new album. I only read it in WH Smith, so I can't vouch for the accuracy of what follows. Has anyone ever been told off for reading magazines at a train station Smith's? Has anyone who works in a library ever taken the opportunity to shout "THIS ISN'T A WH SMITH'S" at anyone who came in and asked for cigarettes or a pencil case or something? It turns out that 'Beyond the Sunrise' is another Stevie Jackson number. It's this one that has the sitars and the 'party sounds' that they recorded a while ago. As well as 'Family Tree' and 'Marx and Engels' and other things we've known about since 1964, there are two completely new titles mentioned. One is another Stevie song, and I've forgotten its name ('Working Man'? 'Corporate Lawyer'? Something like that, anyway). The other is, horror of horrors, a Stuart Mmmm song. It's called 'The Model' and it has nothing to do with Krautrock. Why is it OK to say 'Krautrock'? 'The Model' b/w 'Computer Love' was the first single I ever bought. Nineteen years later, I'm still not sure what a 'data date' involves. Is it like 7-Zark-7 getting all flustered over Susan in 'Battle of the Planets'? Anyway, back to the egg. There's still no title for it, not even a working one. Well that's what NR says, but he's probably just not in on it. Behind his back the band probably giggle and say things like "Lets do some more noodly overdubs on our new album 'Neil Robertson Is A Cunt'." The rumours that every member but 'group dunce' Colburn has written something for it are true. Neil says it's like "Belle & Sebastian, but more so". I'm not sure this is a good thing. I preferred it when Mark Jones said it would 'blow my mind'. That's all I remember. All go to WH Smith and read it yourselves, you cheapskates. This isn't a book reading. I am increasingly intrigued by the Isobel-encouraging men. Is there no witness on the list prepared to enlighten us? nick xxx +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the undead Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.missprint.org/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Re: Sinister: He had the flu at the age of 24
by angela i hate my last name 08 Jan '00

08 Jan '00

ok after re-reading this last post i sent i think from now on i will take a long pause and think about how i tend to put my foot in my mouth just a tad somtimes..... sorry if i offended any radio head fans....i swear my sins most of the time are of omission rather than comission. so sorry! :-( >From: "angela i hate my last name" <unloveable_(a)hotmail.com> >Reply-To: "angela i hate my last name" <unloveable_(a)hotmail.com> >To: sinister(a)majordomo.net >Subject: Re: Sinister: He had the flu at the age of 24 >Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 11:59:20 CST > >i got the flu for my christmass present, >it lasted till just about yesterday. >the gift that keeps on giving , wouldnt you say? >so ummmmmm i got new flanle sheets for christmass too! >i think they went perfectly with my illness....the pale gray >matched perfectly with my red feaverish cheeks. >everything eles was the kind of gifts you would give to someone you dont >know that well, or dont like very much...like little glass & fake gold >jewlrey boxes, verry ugly candles, and bath smellies. >i didnt know what to think really, i thought this was some kind of message >my family was sending me....either its "we dont know you" >or its "we dont really like you" >mind you i am greatfull for them, but sometimes i just wonder. > >b&s content: >as i was at my friends house durring the holidays helping pack because shes >moving,some freinds came by, and they played alot of radiohead! alot! >so i asked if i could put in somthing different, so guess what i put in? >i'll give you 3 guesses.... >and to my utter shock, none of them liked it,"we dont like 70's music" my >friend even said "hes sings off key" >am i missing somthing here? or are they just stupid? >but theses are the same people who enjoyed episode one from starwars >too....otherwise having very good taste >well gotta go bye >angela > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > >+----------------------------------------------------------------------+ > +---+ Brought to you by the undead Sinister mailing list +---+ > To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe > send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to > "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.missprint.org/sinister >+-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ >+-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ >+-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+ >+----------------------------------------------------------------------+ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the undead Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.missprint.org/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: test12
by Honey Droolz 07 Jan '00

07 Jan '00

+----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the undead Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)missprint.org". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)missprint.org". WWW: http://www.missprint.org/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: test11
by honey＠missprint.org 07 Jan '00

07 Jan '00

+----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the undead Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)missprint.org". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)missprint.org". WWW: http://www.missprint.org/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: test4
by Honey 07 Jan '00

07 Jan '00

>From rjonkman(a)ittc.ukans.edu Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 11:02:47 -0500 From: Roelof JT Jonkman <rjonkman(a)ittc.ukans.edu> To: unisog(a)sans.org Cc: Mark Reimer <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca> Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.3 3/22/99 Mark, Etherpeek seems ok for that, we use it on and off. http://www.aggroup.com mrtg is sort of a neat tool too. http://ee-staff.ethz.ch/~oetiker/webtools/mrtg/mrtg.html roel Systems & Network hacker ITTC/University of Kansas >From RGolshan(a)Central.UH.EDU Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 11:01:31 -0500 From: "Golshan, Reza" <RGolshan(a)Central.UH.EDU> To: 'Mark Reimer ' <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca>, "'unisog(a)sans.org '" <unisog(a)sans.org> Cc: "'reza(a)uh.edu'" <reza(a)uh.edu> Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) [ The following text is in the "iso-8859-1" character set. ] [ Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set. ] [ Some characters may be displayed incorrectly. ] Take a look at; http://www.telecomm.uh.edu/statistics.html which uses; http://ee-staff.ethz.ch/~oetiker/webtools/mrtg/mrtg.html Reza -----Original Message----- From: Mark Reimer To: unisog(a)sans.org Sent: 8/18/99 9:41 AM Subject: Network (Ethernet) Monitors Hi all, I'm looking at software for monitoring my local network(s). I'm just looking for general monitoring (how much bandwidth is being used, number of frames etc). Ideally it would catch Ethernet errors as well. I'm looking for it to run on DOS or Windows 95/NT. Any recommendations will be appreciated. Mark ======================================== Mark Reimer, MCSE PC Specialist Information Services, Prairie Bible Institute Phone: 403-443-5511 Ext: 3476 Fax: 403-443-5540 E-mail: mark.reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca >From vanepp(a)sfu.ca Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 09:58:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Peter Van Epp <vanepp(a)sfu.ca> To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] I believe NeTraMet still supports a DOS version ... ftp://ftp.auckland.ac.nz/pub/iawg/NeTraMet/ Peter Van Epp / Operations and Technical Support Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C. Canada >From milindj(a)mastek.com Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 22:14:27 +0530 From: Milind A. Joshi <milindj(a)mastek.com> To: unisog(a)sans.org, Mark Reimer <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca> Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) [ Part 1, Text/PLAIN 32 lines. ] [ Unable to print this part. ] Try an evaluation copy of statscout - www.statscout.com There are may others... Milind ---------- From: Mark Reimer[SMTP:Mark.Reimer@pbi.ab.ca] Sent: August 18, 1999 8:11 PM To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: Network (Ethernet) Monitors Hi all, I'm looking at software for monitoring my local network(s). I'm just looking for general monitoring (how much bandwidth is being used, number of frames etc). Ideally it would catch Ethernet errors as well. I'm looking for it to run on DOS or Windows 95/NT. Any recommendations will be appreciated. Mark ======================================== Mark Reimer, MCSE PC Specialist Information Services, Prairie Bible Institute Phone: 403-443-5511 Ext: 3476 Fax: 403-443-5540 E-mail: mark.reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca >From stoermer(a)unt.edu Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 13:32:26 -0500 From: Chris Stoermer <stoermer(a)unt.edu> To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) If you have manageable switches, you usually get software with them. I am testing two CentreCOM 8126XL 100Mg switches which come with "onboard" management tools via telnet and web. This particular model can break down switch traffic by each port. You can also disable each port via the management tool. Date sent: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 08:41:37 -0600 From: Mark Reimer <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca> Subject: Network (Ethernet) Monitors To: unisog(a)sans.org Hi all, I'm looking at software for monitoring my local network(s). I'm just looking for general monitoring (how much bandwidth is being used, number of frames etc). Ideally it would catch Ethernet errors as well. I'm looking for it to run on DOS or Windows 95/NT. Any recommendations will be appreciated. Mark ======================================== Mark Reimer, MCSE PC Specialist Information Services, Prairie Bible Institute Phone: 403-443-5511 Ext: 3476 Fax: 403-443-5540 E-mail: mark.reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca Chris Stoermer Computer Support Specialist III College of Business Administration University of North Texas Email: stoermer(a)unt.edu Office: 940.369.8613 Fax: 940.565.4930 WEB: http://www.coba.unt.edu >From houserd(a)odc.edu Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 16:11:38 -0400 From: "Houser, Dan" <houserd(a)odc.edu> To: "'unisog(a)sans.org'" <unisog(a)sans.org> Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) [ The following text is in the "iso-8859-1" character set. ] [ Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set. ] [ Some characters may be displayed incorrectly. ] > From: Doug Hughes [mailto:Doug.Hughes@Eng.Auburn.EDU] > Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors > > If you have switches, host based monitoring of bandwidth is moot. > > DOug IMHO.... Not. I am still constrained by the backbone bandwidth, regardless of the front-end solution. A common misconception held by networking professionals when they migrate from hubs to switches is that you now have full bandwidth utilization. Unfortunately, it only gives you full bandwidth to the backbone, which may not buy you much... (I had a client once who couldn't understand why their 10/100 switch wasn't providing better performance than their hub had been. Of course, it was because the switch was plugged into a legacy 10MB backplane, just like the old hub had been. The maximum throughput was still 10MB shared.) ddh >From Fred.Kiani(a)EP01.EGGINC.COM Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 14:29:30 -0400 From: "Kiani, Fred" <Fred.Kiani(a)EP01.EGGINC.COM> To: 'Mark Reimer' <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca>, unisog(a)sans.org Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) It really depends how much money you would be willing to spend. I have not checked HP OpenView on DOS but it is working fine on NT. Best regards, Fred Kiani -----Original Message----- From: Mark Reimer [SMTP:Mark.Reimer@pbi.ab.ca] Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 10:42 AM To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: Network (Ethernet) Monitors Hi all, I'm looking at software for monitoring my local network(s). I'm just looking for general monitoring (how much bandwidth is being used, number of frames etc). Ideally it would catch Ethernet errors as well. I'm looking for it to run on DOS or Windows 95/NT. Any recommendations will be appreciated. Mark ======================================== Mark Reimer, MCSE PC Specialist Information Services, Prairie Bible Institute Phone: 403-443-5511 Ext: 3476 Fax: 403-443-5540 E-mail: mark.reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca >From Doug.Hughes(a)Eng.Auburn.EDU Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 15:58:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Doug Hughes <Doug.Hughes(a)Eng.Auburn.EDU> To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: TkMail 4.0beta9 > >> From: Doug Hughes [mailto:Doug.Hughes@Eng.Auburn.EDU] >> Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors >> >> If you have switches, host based monitoring of bandwidth is moot. >> >> DOug > >IMHO.... > >Not. I am still constrained by the backbone bandwidth, regardless of the >front-end solution. > >A common misconception held by networking professionals when they migrate >from hubs to switches is that you now have full bandwidth utilization. >Unfortunately, it only gives you full bandwidth to the backbone, which may >not buy you much... (I had a client once who couldn't understand why their >10/100 switch wasn't providing better performance than their hub had been. >Of course, it was because the switch was plugged into a legacy 10MB >backplane, just like the old hub had been. The maximum throughput was still >10MB shared.) > I think you missed my point. If you have a switch installed, then any host based monitoring will show you (max) the bandwidth to that 'one' machine. All other bandwidth utilization is completely invisible. Of course, if all traffic is to that one machine (unlikely in most cases, but possible from your one example if you disregard any Internet traffic), then you would see it all. I would regard this as highly unusual, unless that one machine is a firewall or choke gateway of some sort. That was not indicated in the original post, but also possible I suppose. I'm not sure that I would want to turn my firewall into a network/bandwidth management platform as well. (I'm pretty sure I wouldn't..) In most common cases attempting to measure backbone bandwidth from a single machine is apt to be... unproductive.. (based upon measuring using software and a NIC in promiscuous mode on a single host as was inferred from the original posting) In all cases a smart switch will be able to tell you where your bandwidth is being used. You just have to know how to collect the data (or use the vendor provided software). RMON is a big plus here. +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the undead Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)missprint.org". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)missprint.org". WWW: http://www.missprint.org/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

1 0

Sinister: test2
by Honey 07 Jan '00

07 Jan '00

>From rjonkman(a)ittc.ukans.edu Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 11:02:47 -0500 From: Roelof JT Jonkman <rjonkman(a)ittc.ukans.edu> To: unisog(a)sans.org Cc: Mark Reimer <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca> Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.3 3/22/99 Mark, Etherpeek seems ok for that, we use it on and off. http://www.aggroup.com mrtg is sort of a neat tool too. http://ee-staff.ethz.ch/~oetiker/webtools/mrtg/mrtg.html roel Systems & Network hacker ITTC/University of Kansas >From RGolshan(a)Central.UH.EDU Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 11:01:31 -0500 From: "Golshan, Reza" <RGolshan(a)Central.UH.EDU> To: 'Mark Reimer ' <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca>, "'unisog(a)sans.org '" <unisog(a)sans.org> Cc: "'reza(a)uh.edu'" <reza(a)uh.edu> Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) [ The following text is in the "iso-8859-1" character set. ] [ Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set. ] [ Some characters may be displayed incorrectly. ] Take a look at; http://www.telecomm.uh.edu/statistics.html which uses; http://ee-staff.ethz.ch/~oetiker/webtools/mrtg/mrtg.html Reza -----Original Message----- From: Mark Reimer To: unisog(a)sans.org Sent: 8/18/99 9:41 AM Subject: Network (Ethernet) Monitors Hi all, I'm looking at software for monitoring my local network(s). I'm just looking for general monitoring (how much bandwidth is being used, number of frames etc). Ideally it would catch Ethernet errors as well. I'm looking for it to run on DOS or Windows 95/NT. Any recommendations will be appreciated. Mark ======================================== Mark Reimer, MCSE PC Specialist Information Services, Prairie Bible Institute Phone: 403-443-5511 Ext: 3476 Fax: 403-443-5540 E-mail: mark.reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca >From vanepp(a)sfu.ca Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 09:58:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Peter Van Epp <vanepp(a)sfu.ca> To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] I believe NeTraMet still supports a DOS version ... ftp://ftp.auckland.ac.nz/pub/iawg/NeTraMet/ Peter Van Epp / Operations and Technical Support Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C. Canada >From milindj(a)mastek.com Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 22:14:27 +0530 From: Milind A. Joshi <milindj(a)mastek.com> To: unisog(a)sans.org, Mark Reimer <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca> Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) [ Part 1, Text/PLAIN 32 lines. ] [ Unable to print this part. ] Try an evaluation copy of statscout - www.statscout.com There are may others... Milind ---------- From: Mark Reimer[SMTP:Mark.Reimer@pbi.ab.ca] Sent: August 18, 1999 8:11 PM To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: Network (Ethernet) Monitors Hi all, I'm looking at software for monitoring my local network(s). I'm just looking for general monitoring (how much bandwidth is being used, number of frames etc). Ideally it would catch Ethernet errors as well. I'm looking for it to run on DOS or Windows 95/NT. Any recommendations will be appreciated. Mark ======================================== Mark Reimer, MCSE PC Specialist Information Services, Prairie Bible Institute Phone: 403-443-5511 Ext: 3476 Fax: 403-443-5540 E-mail: mark.reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca >From stoermer(a)unt.edu Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 13:32:26 -0500 From: Chris Stoermer <stoermer(a)unt.edu> To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) If you have manageable switches, you usually get software with them. I am testing two CentreCOM 8126XL 100Mg switches which come with "onboard" management tools via telnet and web. This particular model can break down switch traffic by each port. You can also disable each port via the management tool. Date sent: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 08:41:37 -0600 From: Mark Reimer <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca> Subject: Network (Ethernet) Monitors To: unisog(a)sans.org Hi all, I'm looking at software for monitoring my local network(s). I'm just looking for general monitoring (how much bandwidth is being used, number of frames etc). Ideally it would catch Ethernet errors as well. I'm looking for it to run on DOS or Windows 95/NT. Any recommendations will be appreciated. Mark ======================================== Mark Reimer, MCSE PC Specialist Information Services, Prairie Bible Institute Phone: 403-443-5511 Ext: 3476 Fax: 403-443-5540 E-mail: mark.reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca Chris Stoermer Computer Support Specialist III College of Business Administration University of North Texas Email: stoermer(a)unt.edu Office: 940.369.8613 Fax: 940.565.4930 WEB: http://www.coba.unt.edu >From houserd(a)odc.edu Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 16:11:38 -0400 From: "Houser, Dan" <houserd(a)odc.edu> To: "'unisog(a)sans.org'" <unisog(a)sans.org> Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) [ The following text is in the "iso-8859-1" character set. ] [ Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set. ] [ Some characters may be displayed incorrectly. ] > From: Doug Hughes [mailto:Doug.Hughes@Eng.Auburn.EDU] > Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors > > If you have switches, host based monitoring of bandwidth is moot. > > DOug IMHO.... Not. I am still constrained by the backbone bandwidth, regardless of the front-end solution. A common misconception held by networking professionals when they migrate from hubs to switches is that you now have full bandwidth utilization. Unfortunately, it only gives you full bandwidth to the backbone, which may not buy you much... (I had a client once who couldn't understand why their 10/100 switch wasn't providing better performance than their hub had been. Of course, it was because the switch was plugged into a legacy 10MB backplane, just like the old hub had been. The maximum throughput was still 10MB shared.) ddh >From Fred.Kiani(a)EP01.EGGINC.COM Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 14:29:30 -0400 From: "Kiani, Fred" <Fred.Kiani(a)EP01.EGGINC.COM> To: 'Mark Reimer' <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca>, unisog(a)sans.org Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) It really depends how much money you would be willing to spend. I have not checked HP OpenView on DOS but it is working fine on NT. Best regards, Fred Kiani -----Original Message----- From: Mark Reimer [SMTP:Mark.Reimer@pbi.ab.ca] Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 10:42 AM To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: Network (Ethernet) Monitors Hi all, I'm looking at software for monitoring my local network(s). I'm just looking for general monitoring (how much bandwidth is being used, number of frames etc). Ideally it would catch Ethernet errors as well. I'm looking for it to run on DOS or Windows 95/NT. Any recommendations will be appreciated. Mark ======================================== Mark Reimer, MCSE PC Specialist Information Services, Prairie Bible Institute Phone: 403-443-5511 Ext: 3476 Fax: 403-443-5540 E-mail: mark.reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca >From Doug.Hughes(a)Eng.Auburn.EDU Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 15:58:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Doug Hughes <Doug.Hughes(a)Eng.Auburn.EDU> To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: TkMail 4.0beta9 > >> From: Doug Hughes [mailto:Doug.Hughes@Eng.Auburn.EDU] >> Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors >> >> If you have switches, host based monitoring of bandwidth is moot. >> >> DOug > >IMHO.... > >Not. I am still constrained by the backbone bandwidth, regardless of the >front-end solution. > >A common misconception held by networking professionals when they migrate >from hubs to switches is that you now have full bandwidth utilization. >Unfortunately, it only gives you full bandwidth to the backbone, which may >not buy you much... (I had a client once who couldn't understand why their >10/100 switch wasn't providing better performance than their hub had been. >Of course, it was because the switch was plugged into a legacy 10MB >backplane, just like the old hub had been. The maximum throughput was still >10MB shared.) > I think you missed my point. If you have a switch installed, then any host based monitoring will show you (max) the bandwidth to that 'one' machine. All other bandwidth utilization is completely invisible. Of course, if all traffic is to that one machine (unlikely in most cases, but possible from your one example if you disregard any Internet traffic), then you would see it all. I would regard this as highly unusual, unless that one machine is a firewall or choke gateway of some sort. That was not indicated in the original post, but also possible I suppose. I'm not sure that I would want to turn my firewall into a network/bandwidth management platform as well. (I'm pretty sure I wouldn't..) In most common cases attempting to measure backbone bandwidth from a single machine is apt to be... unproductive.. (based upon measuring using software and a NIC in promiscuous mode on a single host as was inferred from the original posting) In all cases a smart switch will be able to tell you where your bandwidth is being used. You just have to know how to collect the data (or use the vendor provided software). RMON is a big plus here. +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the undead Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)missprint.org". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)missprint.org". WWW: http://www.missprint.org/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: test1
by Honey 07 Jan '00

07 Jan '00

>From rjonkman(a)ittc.ukans.edu Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 11:02:47 -0500 From: Roelof JT Jonkman <rjonkman(a)ittc.ukans.edu> To: unisog(a)sans.org Cc: Mark Reimer <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca> Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.3 3/22/99 Mark, Etherpeek seems ok for that, we use it on and off. http://www.aggroup.com mrtg is sort of a neat tool too. http://ee-staff.ethz.ch/~oetiker/webtools/mrtg/mrtg.html roel Systems & Network hacker ITTC/University of Kansas >From RGolshan(a)Central.UH.EDU Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 11:01:31 -0500 From: "Golshan, Reza" <RGolshan(a)Central.UH.EDU> To: 'Mark Reimer ' <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca>, "'unisog(a)sans.org '" <unisog(a)sans.org> Cc: "'reza(a)uh.edu'" <reza(a)uh.edu> Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) [ The following text is in the "iso-8859-1" character set. ] [ Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set. ] [ Some characters may be displayed incorrectly. ] Take a look at; http://www.telecomm.uh.edu/statistics.html which uses; http://ee-staff.ethz.ch/~oetiker/webtools/mrtg/mrtg.html Reza -----Original Message----- From: Mark Reimer To: unisog(a)sans.org Sent: 8/18/99 9:41 AM Subject: Network (Ethernet) Monitors Hi all, I'm looking at software for monitoring my local network(s). I'm just looking for general monitoring (how much bandwidth is being used, number of frames etc). Ideally it would catch Ethernet errors as well. I'm looking for it to run on DOS or Windows 95/NT. Any recommendations will be appreciated. Mark ======================================== Mark Reimer, MCSE PC Specialist Information Services, Prairie Bible Institute Phone: 403-443-5511 Ext: 3476 Fax: 403-443-5540 E-mail: mark.reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca >From vanepp(a)sfu.ca Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 09:58:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Peter Van Epp <vanepp(a)sfu.ca> To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] I believe NeTraMet still supports a DOS version ... ftp://ftp.auckland.ac.nz/pub/iawg/NeTraMet/ Peter Van Epp / Operations and Technical Support Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C. Canada >From milindj(a)mastek.com Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 22:14:27 +0530 From: Milind A. Joshi <milindj(a)mastek.com> To: unisog(a)sans.org, Mark Reimer <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca> Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) [ Part 1, Text/PLAIN 32 lines. ] [ Unable to print this part. ] Try an evaluation copy of statscout - www.statscout.com There are may others... Milind ---------- From: Mark Reimer[SMTP:Mark.Reimer@pbi.ab.ca] Sent: August 18, 1999 8:11 PM To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: Network (Ethernet) Monitors Hi all, I'm looking at software for monitoring my local network(s). I'm just looking for general monitoring (how much bandwidth is being used, number of frames etc). Ideally it would catch Ethernet errors as well. I'm looking for it to run on DOS or Windows 95/NT. Any recommendations will be appreciated. Mark ======================================== Mark Reimer, MCSE PC Specialist Information Services, Prairie Bible Institute Phone: 403-443-5511 Ext: 3476 Fax: 403-443-5540 E-mail: mark.reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca >From stoermer(a)unt.edu Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 13:32:26 -0500 From: Chris Stoermer <stoermer(a)unt.edu> To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) If you have manageable switches, you usually get software with them. I am testing two CentreCOM 8126XL 100Mg switches which come with "onboard" management tools via telnet and web. This particular model can break down switch traffic by each port. You can also disable each port via the management tool. Date sent: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 08:41:37 -0600 From: Mark Reimer <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca> Subject: Network (Ethernet) Monitors To: unisog(a)sans.org Hi all, I'm looking at software for monitoring my local network(s). I'm just looking for general monitoring (how much bandwidth is being used, number of frames etc). Ideally it would catch Ethernet errors as well. I'm looking for it to run on DOS or Windows 95/NT. Any recommendations will be appreciated. Mark ======================================== Mark Reimer, MCSE PC Specialist Information Services, Prairie Bible Institute Phone: 403-443-5511 Ext: 3476 Fax: 403-443-5540 E-mail: mark.reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca Chris Stoermer Computer Support Specialist III College of Business Administration University of North Texas Email: stoermer(a)unt.edu Office: 940.369.8613 Fax: 940.565.4930 WEB: http://www.coba.unt.edu >From houserd(a)odc.edu Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 16:11:38 -0400 From: "Houser, Dan" <houserd(a)odc.edu> To: "'unisog(a)sans.org'" <unisog(a)sans.org> Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) [ The following text is in the "iso-8859-1" character set. ] [ Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set. ] [ Some characters may be displayed incorrectly. ] > From: Doug Hughes [mailto:Doug.Hughes@Eng.Auburn.EDU] > Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors > > If you have switches, host based monitoring of bandwidth is moot. > > DOug IMHO.... Not. I am still constrained by the backbone bandwidth, regardless of the front-end solution. A common misconception held by networking professionals when they migrate from hubs to switches is that you now have full bandwidth utilization. Unfortunately, it only gives you full bandwidth to the backbone, which may not buy you much... (I had a client once who couldn't understand why their 10/100 switch wasn't providing better performance than their hub had been. Of course, it was because the switch was plugged into a legacy 10MB backplane, just like the old hub had been. The maximum throughput was still 10MB shared.) ddh >From Fred.Kiani(a)EP01.EGGINC.COM Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 14:29:30 -0400 From: "Kiani, Fred" <Fred.Kiani(a)EP01.EGGINC.COM> To: 'Mark Reimer' <Mark.Reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca>, unisog(a)sans.org Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) It really depends how much money you would be willing to spend. I have not checked HP OpenView on DOS but it is working fine on NT. Best regards, Fred Kiani -----Original Message----- From: Mark Reimer [SMTP:Mark.Reimer@pbi.ab.ca] Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 10:42 AM To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: Network (Ethernet) Monitors Hi all, I'm looking at software for monitoring my local network(s). I'm just looking for general monitoring (how much bandwidth is being used, number of frames etc). Ideally it would catch Ethernet errors as well. I'm looking for it to run on DOS or Windows 95/NT. Any recommendations will be appreciated. Mark ======================================== Mark Reimer, MCSE PC Specialist Information Services, Prairie Bible Institute Phone: 403-443-5511 Ext: 3476 Fax: 403-443-5540 E-mail: mark.reimer(a)pbi.ab.ca >From Doug.Hughes(a)Eng.Auburn.EDU Wed Dec 15 17:35:38 1999 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 15:58:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Doug Hughes <Doug.Hughes(a)Eng.Auburn.EDU> To: unisog(a)sans.org Subject: RE: Network (Ethernet) Monitors X-Mailer: TkMail 4.0beta9 > >> From: Doug Hughes [mailto:Doug.Hughes@Eng.Auburn.EDU] >> Subject: Re: Network (Ethernet) Monitors >> >> If you have switches, host based monitoring of bandwidth is moot. >> >> DOug > >IMHO.... > >Not. I am still constrained by the backbone bandwidth, regardless of the >front-end solution. > >A common misconception held by networking professionals when they migrate >from hubs to switches is that you now have full bandwidth utilization. >Unfortunately, it only gives you full bandwidth to the backbone, which may >not buy you much... (I had a client once who couldn't understand why their >10/100 switch wasn't providing better performance than their hub had been. >Of course, it was because the switch was plugged into a legacy 10MB >backplane, just like the old hub had been. The maximum throughput was still >10MB shared.) > I think you missed my point. If you have a switch installed, then any host based monitoring will show you (max) the bandwidth to that 'one' machine. All other bandwidth utilization is completely invisible. Of course, if all traffic is to that one machine (unlikely in most cases, but possible from your one example if you disregard any Internet traffic), then you would see it all. I would regard this as highly unusual, unless that one machine is a firewall or choke gateway of some sort. That was not indicated in the original post, but also possible I suppose. I'm not sure that I would want to turn my firewall into a network/bandwidth management platform as well. (I'm pretty sure I wouldn't..) In most common cases attempting to measure backbone bandwidth from a single machine is apt to be... unproductive.. (based upon measuring using software and a NIC in promiscuous mode on a single host as was inferred from the original posting) In all cases a smart switch will be able to tell you where your bandwidth is being used. You just have to know how to collect the data (or use the vendor provided software). RMON is a big plus here. +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the undead Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)missprint.org". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)missprint.org". WWW: http://www.missprint.org/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: Mine is a devil�s haircut....
by Jordi Trenzano 07 Jan '00

07 Jan '00

Hi, 11++ souls: ItŽs good to hear how well you had your new yearŽs eve. I told you that mine was really crap, but I had fun. Well, it wasnŽt my intended topic. I just need to say something, with my advance apologies to Zoe and all Beck fans round here: am I the only person on earth who thinks that heŽs absolutely overrated ? I know what iŽm saying, as I saw him play live and iŽve got "Mellow gold" and "Odelay". HeŽs a funny lad, with some clown-musicians, some nice singles but iŽm miles far to see him as this godlike genius that everyone wants to make me believe. I saw the video of "Sexlaws" yesterday, and the song is good, but nothing really special, and those machines having sex is nothing more original than the Terry GilliamŽs animated shorts on The Monty PythonŽs Flying Circus. And it was at the late 60Žs - early 70Žs. I donŽt know if iŽll start an argument here, but I guess that the lack of B&S news is making this list a bit strange lately (IŽm not talking about the posts, I think that youŽre lovely people everybody). Love and New Pollution Jordiet Sinistre ______________________________________________________________ For up-to-the-minute music news, reviews and specials visit http://www.nme.com Get free e-mail (anyname(a)nme.com) now at http://www.nmemail.com The sender of this e-mail is NOT an employee or associate of NME, nme.com or any other IPC magazine. +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the undead Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.missprint.org/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Re: Sinister: He had the flu at the age of 24
by angela i hate my last name 07 Jan '00

07 Jan '00

i got the flu for my christmass present, it lasted till just about yesterday. the gift that keeps on giving , wouldnt you say? so ummmmmm i got new flanle sheets for christmass too! i think they went perfectly with my illness....the pale gray matched perfectly with my red feaverish cheeks. everything eles was the kind of gifts you would give to someone you dont know that well, or dont like very much...like little glass & fake gold jewlrey boxes, verry ugly candles, and bath smellies. i didnt know what to think really, i thought this was some kind of message my family was sending me....either its "we dont know you" or its "we dont really like you" mind you i am greatfull for them, but sometimes i just wonder. b&s content: as i was at my friends house durring the holidays helping pack because shes moving,some freinds came by, and they played alot of radiohead! alot! so i asked if i could put in somthing different, so guess what i put in? i'll give you 3 guesses.... and to my utter shock, none of them liked it,"we dont like 70's music" my friend even said "hes sings off key" am i missing somthing here? or are they just stupid? but theses are the same people who enjoyed episode one from starwars too....otherwise having very good taste well gotta go bye angela ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the undead Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.missprint.org/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: He had the flu at the age of 24
by Robert Brennan 07 Jan '00

07 Jan '00

Caught Apocalypse Tube whilst recovering from Christmas lurgee. Funny how any headache can be increased ten fold by the application of Chris Moyles. But nice performance when it eventually arrived. I sat up for as long as I could manage to see if they returned. Instead I found my ears boxed senseless by Robbie 'bow before my cheeky grin' Williams. Finally saw 'Dogma' the other week. Enjoyed it but it's the first Kevin Smith film I wouldn't recommend to people who've not seen other Kevin Smith films. Easy on the in-jokes there, boy. Jay & Silent Bob hilarious as ever. Helpful hint from recent life experience: Never leave your mobile phone on a train. Expecially when it's not yours. That is all... Laters. Rob. ____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the undead Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.missprint.org/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "sinsietr is a bit freaky" - stuart david, looper +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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