May 1999 - Sinister - missprint.org

Sinister: Random stuff
by Gary Lawler 21 May '99

21 May '99

Cliques, eh? I agree with Justin on this one - they're inevitable. People will gravitiate towards people most like themselves and form a little tribe. Nothing really wrong with it, it's happening right now on a hundred different boards and lists right now. As long as it doesn't disrupt the day-to-day runnings of things, I say let it be. Meh. The B&S newsgroup isn't showing up on my server yet. Lot of talk about shyness . . . has anyone ever seen Neon Genesis Evangelion? About this really, really shy kid and how he deals with the people around him (he also fights Angels in a giant robot, but that's beside the point). I'm up to vol.8 and it's quite good. Ooh, short post. -- Gary Lawler * ICQ UIN: 11115268 * AIM: seclite369 +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the reborn Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.majordomo.net/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "jelly-filled danishes" +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: Os Mutantes! Os Mutantes! Os Mutantes!
by Cynthia Someone 21 May '99

21 May '99

Hello everyone: I've been very sad to hear about all the mutter and flufferings about the list, and that some people may be leaving because we have heard two sides to the story, two extreme sides, and a couple of reactions to which. But I wanted to make some suppositions. I don't know if there is anyone to blame for all of this, the only thing I could blame is Negativity and Faithlessness. Faithlessness that the list will become boring, which, obviously, has not been of late, with much philosophizing on romanticism and shyness and things. and negativity because people choose to see other people as having bad intentions. and do they really? I can't imagine ex-listees having anti-list sentiment that would be really worth anyone's consideration. I'm sure they mean no harm towards anyone personally, and perhaps have what the Buddhists would call "wrong view". I tend to believe that the reason why people get upset, or negative, is because of a misunderstanding of the way of things, and that being upset or negative creates these hard, unwavering criticisms of people on the list, et cetera. Basically, i think i am trying to say that people are being unwise. in all sorts of ways. I do, however, think that having a select, unelected group of people determining the way of the list can be stifling. I used to live in a cooperative, that was so dedicated to an extremely liberal way of life, very hippie, they used to have white sugar wars in "the good old days" but when new people came in, a new breed, there was a lot of negativity in the house, which completely ruined the ideals of the house in the long run. Hippieness became an "image" more than a way of life, and everyone felt bad because they couldn't live up to them. The house has lost all it's flavor. Look what's happened to the Catholic Church: all these people losing touch with an outdated way. I think maybe it would be a good idea if we came up with a list of rules that could be agreed upon by everyone, and maybe come up with a cleaner, better way for honey to seek out advice. or at least trust that the honey filters out bad and good advice, eschews back-handed criticism, et cetera. with the idea that the list is a changing thing, and everyone must stay open and positive. I personally don't blame honey, i think everyone makes mistakes. lesley jo said: the romantics and symbolists found emotion and esthetic more important than giving a moral message, or depicting in photographic/scientific reality--they preferred to draw from mythology, and simply make things that were exotic, splendid and beautiful to look at. someone might say it's morally empty---i dont 'see it like that at all. it's art for the sake of itself. I think that all art has a spiritual basis, and spirit and morals go hand in hand. one must have spirit to have morals. Music has the power to soften the heart and open the way to right understanding. Morally empty? I should say not. no music lacks a political and social stance, be it positive or negative. Music can be morally empty, but it comes from a lack of vision from the musician. Avante garde, folk music, whatever, matters little the genre. We listen to music, and we hear the heart of the musician. some people have more soul than others. Accusations of a genre of having merit this way or that, falls by the wayside wehn we are blown away by the spirit of the musician. Bjork succeeds because she has the sould of a banshee. {insert plug for the mysticism of sound and music, by hazrat inayat khan from the Sinister book club.} Cynthia _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the reborn Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.majordomo.net/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "jelly-filled danishes" +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: Non-clique-related post
by V0168JE2 21 May '99

21 May '99

I asked you all about which books i should get a few days ago and got one hell of a response, so i compiled a table with one point gained for a reccomendation, one lost for a condemnation, and half- points given out for various mixed responses. So top of the table came The Great Gatsby (8 points) which you all seem to love, second came The Unbearable Lightness of Being (5 points) and third came Lucky Jim (4 1/2 points), so I'll get those three. Thank you all. Last came Garrison Kellar with minus 3 1/2 points, evidently not popular in sinister-land. I had it described as "really boring," "really bad bathroom table stuff," "literature-lite" and, scarliy, "it'll make your eyes bleed." So I won't get that then. I'll reply to you all and the other 50 or so e-mails in the next week now I've got some free time on my hands. Oh, and otherwise I notice that another sinister campaign has been succesful, with coco pops again avaliable on the shelves of asda thanks to her fluffyness and her direct action campaign. I wonder if she played "what shall we do" by the open university to them until they promised to resore the pop title. Stay twee, xxxxx weejay. PS alright, I lied. I think we should all give the list a chance, but I also think that if we (rightly and reasonably, IMHO) can't discuss the list on the list then there shouldn't be some big discussion elsewhere that some of us are excluded from. I hope this hasn't been the case though. Blue Glow is now at http://diskant.future.easyspace.com/blueglow/ (This network is as sick as a dog. If you can't get through try maleslut(a)chickmail.com instead) +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the reborn Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.majordomo.net/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "jelly-filled danishes" +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Re: Sinister: They shoot Hipsters, don't they?
by Joss Moorkens 21 May '99

21 May '99

FunkySeb wrote: Face it, when did you last cry with either laughter or gut ripping emotion after reading a post? Which seemed pretty elitist to me. And pretty insulting to everyone who puts such effort into what they write. Suffice to say I'm still subscribed here because I get something out of it. Whether or not there's a correlating commentary list makes fuck all difference to me. A list about a list eh? Whatever will they think of next.... Joss +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the reborn Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.majordomo.net/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "jelly-filled danishes" +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: Too funky for me
by poetryplace2 21 May '99

21 May '99

Sorry to clog up your in-boxes with dull politics, but I wanted to support Honey and correct a few rather nasty insinuations Firstly I oughta say that Mr Seb's flair for melodramatic flouncing shows that his drama lessons haven't entirely gone to waste. Secondy, a little more seriously, can I respond to a few points here? "since [SOS's] founding 5-6 months ago the list has become more and more tired...because so many of the people who used to contribute so much to the real list have stopped posting". Well I can only disagree. I like to think the list has got much better, partly through the institution of such ideas as the nursery, which allows people to acclimatise to the list, and points them in the direction of FAQs, biographies, details of Tigermilk etc. As to the supposed idea that SOS was cherry-picking the best posters and sapping Sinister, I can only say this is poppycock. I think I personally mailed one three line post in the entire time that SOS existed. To the best of my recollection nobody else posted very much more. The enthralling issues of discussion were, respectively, the question of the nursery, and the question of web-hosting. Paul asked some mates for advice. Lots of people do this. I know of several spin-off discussions from Sinister... some people set up little groups for their bowlie chalet, some people set up groups in their particular neck of the woods to co-ordinate picnics and things, Mistopher Christopher has the sleeka sounds list. There was even at one point a list for people who were providing B&S-related web resources. I dont tend to think of these as particularly malevolent. But then I don't like the x-files either. "I can only think that they spend so much time seeing if our post are up to scratch" Well, if this isnt paranoia, I don't know what is. On what do you base this supposition, Seb? Do you imagine a crew of ice-skating judges holding up marker cards? "I've read things from the SOS list and I've read bullying letters sent by its members". I'd be fascinated to know what these are Seb. No, really I would. I think it's the sign of an interesting mind to realise that generally there are at least two sides to every story and thirteen ways of looking at every blackbird. You seem to have heard one rather warped version. It would have been more interesting to hang around and hear some others, no? Twice in a week now it's been rather demoralising to see people raise potentially interesting debates and walk out slamming the door behind them. I continue to get a great deal out of sinister: I've made terrific mates from all over the world and have had some wonderful times. I think this is because that because, by and large, the population of this list has been hilarious, thought-provoking, and reasonable. It would be an absolute crying shame if this was spoilt by some rather petty-minded and ill-informed paranoia. All the best Stevie Trousers +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the reborn Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.majordomo.net/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "jelly-filled danishes" +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: Re: Reintegration of the list
by Justin Williams 21 May '99

21 May '99

Evening Sinisterines, I know I have only been on this list a very short time compared to most, and I too have already felt the presence of a "clique" but there is absolutely no where in this world where cliques don't exist in one form or another. The clique, that we have here as far as I see it, is of the most harmless of ones. I don't know Seb nor have I ever written to him, and although I have admired many of his postings I agree with Honey that he should not have gone too such an extreme without discussing it first in private. Already I see that Andrew has decided to unsubscribe and unfortunately there will probably be more to follow. As a newbie I have felt many times uncertainty when it came to posting here simply because of my feeling of marginalization, but lately it seems that many newbies have been expressing this concern so why is it that we can't feel welcome when we have each other? I respect the "seniority" of long-term list members without hesitation, but what is keeping us newbies from posting what we want to say (even if it isn't the most updated bit of info you ever did see). I'm not saying that we should just post nonsense about what happens to hit us while we are sitting at the keyboard, but we shouldn't be afraid to start our own conversation string. Who cares if a "selected elite" (which I don't even think exists) is judging our every word? Let them have their opinions and their "second list" if it pleases them, but that shouldn't mean the end of the main list. Obviously Honey cares for this list a great deal or the grief and worry in his posts about the state of the list wouldn't be so apparent. Yeah, there may be a small number of listees that are closer to Honey, and some of them may not agree with what he does. I think we should just trust Honey to set things straight, and I think we owe it to him not to listen to rumors until they have been substantiated. We are a family here. We should try to work out our problems, not run from them. I love you all too Justin W Felonius Monk "Often I tried the frightening way of "reality," Where things that count are profession, law, fashion, finance, But disillusioned and freed I fled away alone To the other side, the place of dreams and blessed folly." - Hermann Hesse, Wanderings +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the reborn Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.majordomo.net/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "jelly-filled danishes" +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: disintergration of the list
by The Narrow Wizard 21 May '99

21 May '99

Well what can I say about the cat that Seb has metaphorically put amongst the pidgeons? Some of you probably think that as a newcomer to the list I have no right to talk about such deep political issues but I feel that a large part of this list is made up of new folk and we are all B&S fans and so this list is for us and we should be able to give an opinion. so what is my opinion? I must say that I never before realised that there was any possibility of this kind of thing happening....my experiences of the list have always been good ones and I am very happy to be part of it. In the 4 hours since I last checked my mail however some very worrying things have taken place. Seb has talked of bullying by a group of members towards people who they feel are contributing the wrong sort of material to the list. Honey has talked of "enemies of the list". This is all very worrying...that such a comunity has enemies astounds me...that bullying has taken place scares me (just take a look at todays other thread in order to learn the terrible consequences of bullying...a debate I will be contributing to but strictly in private to those it concerns). So what can we do about it? well I know what I'm gonna do...I'm gonna continue enjoying this list and the many wonderful people on it....I'm gonna have fun in a B&S related manner (which is why we joined in the first place remember) and I aint gonna leave untill it stops being fun, which if everyone one else does the same is not gonna happen. I love you all please dont die owen With that the narrow wizard waggled his bushy eyebrows and disappeared in a flash of blue flame leaving behind only a faint smell of cinnamon +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the reborn Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.majordomo.net/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "jelly-filled danishes" +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: It's A Sad Day...
by Elish Hope 21 May '99

21 May '99

I think that I speak for most people when I say that this is all very sad. I think that there are a lot of people here who are holding Honey, Jeepster and the Belle's responsible for their personal happiness. Which is a bummer because only you can make you happy, the music just gives you something to sing along to. Again, the world and the above mentioned 'culprits' do not owe anyone anything. If what Seb said is true, that is sad. I will miss his witty posts, but lets move on. Let's not let this turn into some nasty Fraggle where this carries on for days. Honey - I am sorry if your feelings are hurt by all this. Regardless of what if going on, there are a lot of us who are grateful for your time and efforts. Life is made up of a lot of choices. Seb made the choice to write his mail, and thank you for your honesty Seb. But we have the choice to carry this on until this torch burns down the list, or let bygons and be bygons and carry on. The decision is ours. If 'Big Brother' is watching, so be it. We are not exactly cracking atoms here, nothing is top secret on the web anyway. Let's take control of this and choose to move on past this Fraggle and not let it get out of hand and hurt people's feelings. Funny how there have been all these posts about school yard bullies....... Snoggs, elle +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the reborn Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.majordomo.net/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "jelly-filled danishes" +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: Sports Biscuits
by matthew.cropper＠aeat.co.uk 21 May '99

21 May '99

Does anyone have an opinion on the best type of sports biscuit ...mines cricket. Oh yeah. B&S are really great or something...and so am I. +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the reborn Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.majordomo.net/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "jelly-filled danishes" +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Sinister: Where is it?
by Power15755＠aol.com 21 May '99

21 May '99

Where is the mail I sent to Sinister an hour ago gone? Why is it not on the list? :-( Antje *** everybody thought that she was boring so they never listened anyway *** +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ +---+ Brought to you by the reborn Sinister mailing list +---+ To send to the list mail "sinister(a)majordomo.net". To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe sinister" or "unsubscribe sinister-digest" to "majordomo(a)majordomo.net". WWW: http://www.majordomo.net/sinister +-+ "legion of bedroom saddo devotees" "tech-heads and students" +-+ +-+ "the cardie wearing biscuit nibbling belle & sebastian list" +-+ +-+ "jelly-filled danishes" +-+ +----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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